Wenger Angers O'Neill

I don't think we mean to play a long ball game, it is just that every time Cuellar attempts a 5 yard pass he over hits it by 80 yards

He's always been a bit of a nutter, but Martin has completely lost it here. Villa played very well and deserved a point, but we had the best chances.

Slipped to 7th, but still within 3 points of 4th (5th with goal difference), with a game in hand . I dont think we need to be negative here. Yes we haven't scored in 4 games and yes we have been impotent in attack (league cup ignored). But tbh I think we played well. At points we did keep the ball down, when we long balled it.... it put arsenal back, stopped them from playing.. whats wrong with that? Lets not forget the total harassment of Heskey... When on the pitch he as always on the ball getting fouled by les arse. I do feel tonights result is bad, I feel we should have won it. But. 0-0 against arsenal isn't too bad all things considered. Delph looked bright when he came on, looked like he wanted to make a name for himself. That man needs 90 mins. Maybe let Petrov have a breather with his injury?

Not sure Arsenal had the better chances, maybe got their two good chances less off target than our good chances.
I was quite frankly dissappointed with the standard of Arsenal, very little of that stylish football was dispalyed.
As for the long ball game I don't think so, nothing wrong with a good hoof every now and then but we don't play the long ball game. We play the crossing game.

Prblem is, we still need strikers to put the chances away. Would have been nice to see the Fonz.

Good game in the second half. I'd like to wish you guys the very best for the Carling cup final and the rest of the league matches.

Good game in the second half. I'd like to wish you guys the very best for the Carling cup final and the rest of the league matches.

ok so were physical so what. so we hit a long ball.... would you rather the likes of cuellar, dunne and collins try to deftly manouver the ball out of the back?? i doubt it. gimme a break we played well against a good side and here comes the complaining. face it we are not a top 4 side we a trying to become one. you have to play to your strengths. gabby impresses me, fair enough is he technically inept?? yes sure he is but i leave the game knowing what he has done. he works his backside of (mostly) same with ash dont think he gets enough credit for the work he does in a game. it would be great if we had the fox in the box we need and im sure everyone including MON knows this but we dont. what are we supposed to do play a style that doesnt suit our team?? that would be disasterous. milner has played terrificly in the middle but he is still learning a new position so he will only improve. and petrov is petrov i dont especially like the style he plays (mainly backwards) but when your in a midfield with the likes of young, downing and milner we need someone who can hold possesion. we are as stout as we are at the back because of our style of play which means everyone has to work there ass off. if you choose to look at our team with the glass half full you can see we are a team that is 1 maybe 2 players short of being a team that can challenge on many fronts. we can play pretty football when we get the chance. but that doesnt win jack. sure im a MON defender and rightly so IMO. it is hard to see past the weekend sometimes but it is clearly his job to and im glad he takes it as his obligation to look further ahead than that. we are close, keep the faith perhaps not this year but next year with 1 or 2 key additions we will be a team capable of challenging for more than just the 4th spot in the league i guarantee it.

I'm sorry, but if I didn't read this site often I'd have thought this article was written by a gooner. I too think Wenger's comments are extremely disrespectful. We played good football at times today and didn't 'hoof' it all game - jesus, you make us sound like a Sam Allardyce side. And as for the snide comment, "I'm only a fan who doesn't even play people out of position, or only make one sub per game (regardless of the game, the score, the circumstances)" - neither are you the manager who has had us up and around the top 4 for 3 seasons, 4 points off top 4 with a game in hand, in a final in a months time and with a great chance of getting into the quarters of the FA Cup. Sorry, I know it's your opinion, but I quite frankly think your opinion stinks and is nothing but negative bile. I look forward to Mr Fear's thoughts soon as they are generally much more balanced than this anti-MON diatribe

Wenger also said: "I wish them to have a good run now because they are quality. They are well-organised and have a strong spirit. They are very strong physically and the four in midfield do not stop running and all these players can score goals, so they have a chance. I think they have a very good chance but you have seven teams for four places." If MoN is going to get angry with the perceived negatives - if that's what they are - then he should also be willing to acknowledge the positives.

Wenger also said: "I wish them to have a good run now because they are quality. They are well-organised and have a strong spirit. They are very strong physically and the four in midfield do not stop running and all these players can score goals, so they have a chance. I think they have a very good chance but you have seven teams for four places." If MoN is going to get angry with the perceived negatives - if that's what they are - then he should also be willing to acknowledge the positives.

Fair enough, like me MON may have been fed a snippet and reacted in the heat of the moment - doesn't change my opinion on the article above tho!

Fair enough, like me MON may have been fed a snippet and reacted in the heat of the moment - doesn't change my opinion on the article above tho!

I thank you Amos, I think you caught my drift maybe without realising it.

Mike, it is anti MON diatribe and the snide pop just reasserts this. Balanced is looking at negatives and positives and reaching a conclusion. Where are the positives in this article? 1 draw against the top 4 and anything we have achieved is forgotten in favour of the pessimistic, we are not good enough/we play rubbish football..... Yes there are negatives - I don't profess that MON is the perfect manager, but there are also many positives, and we DO NOT always play long ball.

i got your point. it was an article about some of wenger comments after the game. my post was about my views of the game and of the team. we all see it differently and thats cool. i dont believe i wrote anything negative about your article, just stating that im a villa fan and thats the way i see it. boring world if we were all reading of the same page.

But let's face it Mike, real football managers, as opposed to Championship Manager heroes, frequently have to stop quality teams from playing first, then see if there's anything left after that. Arsenal are a fabulous footballing side who are capable of ripping most teams apart if you let them. And boy have they ripped a few recently. But what counts in real football is goals and, in the end, they couldn't put their chances away either, although you seem to have overlooked that. As for whether your article is a diatribe, read it back to yourself and see how much of it is about the football match, and how much of it is about O'Neill, who has undoubtedly done what most managers do - he's has reacted off the cuff to yet another inane comment by a rag journalist. Get over it.

Good point about having to stop a good team like Arsenal from playing, I think we did play well tonight, the problem is the West Ham and Liverpool home games, our problem in front of goal is not simply because we are stopping a good side from playing, maybe it was tonight, but we will struggle to finish against Fulham aswell

No it doesn't....we've talked as a fanbase for months about the style of play (majority being we hoof for the most part) which is extremely frustrating because of how we know we can play. We do it at points, we get it down we wait for openings, we create them etc. Monny always talks about how good we play, even when we are awful, the media are hooked on fast counter attack and young team, and it all serves to gloss over the 'majority' of us (and I include Monny in that given the predictability of the squad - let us not forget the talk of rotation, and then same squad and the excuse is tiredness last match) addressing the problems holding us back.

The world and his dog knows we need a proper striker...say it, and the reference is 6 in the Cup. We don't get it down and play often enough...say it, and the reference is we can't be that bad chasing Top 4 (of recently Cup run). The positives are referenced, we all know where we are in the league and the Cups, but a simple little article on Monny picking and choosing again what to react to, what to create for tomorrow's headlines (just like he has when criticising the fans etc in the past) and it's immediately an anti Monny diatribe, wherein the contents (basically can we stop using X to justify Y and Z) are yet again glossed over.

For most of this season we haven't played brilliantly, but now it's an appalling insult to suggest we hoof it - when in fact we hoof it far more than we should. To reference Benny's comment (don't worry mate I agree would be very boring if we all agreed lol), that means I want Dunne et al to beat 9 players from defence??? Haven't we a midfield who also hoof it?

But this will be tomorrow's papers, not two shots on target, regardless of how well we played, regardless of whether we deserved to win tonight...Monny has again wrote his own headlines and the issue of needing a striker desperately, is again under the carpet, despite the very thing he jumped on being how we play generally which the majority of us lambast daily.

But then again by your last comment I've apparently said we always play long ball which is interesting. But I take your point, even though it's nonsense, about 1 draw against Top 4 means I jump on it as an excuse to be negative and ignore everything that came before, because I find the point ironic as rearrange that sentence to be 1 loss against anybody seems these days to mean we must ignore it and remember everything that came before, which is kind of the very 'spin' I was attacking to begin with.

Bob, the above has got nothing to do with the match tonight - hence why it includes very little match reference. I also didn't praise or criticise how we played tonight, I simply commented on how Monny has used Wenger's comments (that are in the main true) to deflect attention from everything else.

Seems the old gloss over is still working, although I'm unsure how it's an off the cuff Journo comment, given Monny listens to the other managers interviews to see what he can comment on as opposed to the game. No journo involved here.

That said as for getting over it, maybe Monny should. Instead of spinning and criticising why not praise the squad along the very lines you suggest given Arsenal are good and unbeatable? Wouldn't make such a good headline though would it, and God forbid somebody might ask him a question about a striker instead.

Ant I'd agree, but don't forget it still appears that we have to ignore our shortcomings and comment only on what we do well.

"If Ashley really played some long balls today - he didn't have time to play long balls when he was taking that left-back to the cleaners." LMFAO wish I'd have seen that one earlier.

I know why don't we just sack O'Neill?? get O'Leary back would that keep you all happy? oh wait no we should be trying to get Sir Alex Ferguson to come to Villa? or maybe Mourinho, nah there not good enough, lets get Nigel Clough though his dad was great!

Nigel Clough - that's an idea, albeit thoroughly unrelated to the thread.

I think Wenger is a pious hypocrite.

Trust a spud to butt in a debate not involving him at all. Try and get over your Arsenal obsession and get out more hodfoundhehadnonuts.

MON over reacted! Yes we did lay some good football when we had the chance tonight, i don't think that the hoofing is necessarily a major tactic (although it does seem to be Cuellar's favored form of releasing the ball) but a defensive technique (get Effin rid of it, which is bloody right too). A lot of us thought we could of won it but going at MON or any of the boys for a draw with Arsenal is pathetic.

MON should apologise, must have been heat of the moment and he seems to be feeling the pressure lately ? The overall comments from Wenger were accurate and not worth reacting to.

For a draw? Merse I'd suggest reading it again and the comments.

Fair play to MON for defending us IMO, yeah we do play that way at times....but wenger is a turd who needs to stop moaning whenever one of this girly boys gets tackled....i love how they went mental for us to kick a ball out when one of them fannys got a kick, didnt do that last week did ya?****s......

We do play alot of long ball stuff it has to be said, I cannot comment on this particular game as I havent seen it but I did see Wenger's comments and didn't seem to say anything disrespectful, to me it sounds like the guy interviewing O'Neill was s*** stirring!!!

I think tonights comments and reaction from tonights game by MON is further proof of the immense pressure he finds himself under. Look at his reaction post Blackburn match to Big Sams comments about the Ref and the fact that he had a go back at one of the fans after a match who was bad mouthing him. Being MON is not easy, he has high standards, learnt from Coughie and to be quite honest i think he is coping well under the pressure and surely the cracks are going to show now and then. We are all aware that he had money in the summer that he used wisely, almost buying a whole defense for the cost of what City paid for one over rated Lescott, not to mention replacing Barry with options - Delph and Downing. But sadly he is under immense almost impossible pressure to compete with the Buying power of City and Chelsea and attracting high calibre players to take us to that next level when we dont yet have the CL status that the so called BIG FOUR already have. I'm sure MON secretly would love to come out and say that Villa are under the circumstances where they should be, 5th-7th, but it has to be admired that we are still a football club that is run in the black and not in danger of free-fall like Liverpool or Man United. I for one admire MON for his slow progression but do worry that simply maintaining us as a team on the bring of 4th place is our destiny.

Wenger talks about the present, although his words seem to suggest he was calling Villa a long ball team he's not referring to how you always play against everyone else, he's talking about how you usually play us. It's great that 99% of your supporters have been able to see through the media agenda of trying to cause a row where there wasn't one, I have no doubt that some journalist made a comment to O'Neill about how Wenger had claimed your nothing but a long ball team, when thats not the way it was said at all. Like Wenger I really hope you lot take 4th place & although I don't really get to see your games apart from against us or when you're on sky I do in the most part enjoy watching your boys.

Cuellar's distribution and successful pass ratio are the worst in the team by far. With our poor excuses for centre forwards, we have to play hoof ball. Heskey cannot travel with the ball and just flicks on or passes back. Gabby can ONLY travel with the ball and he has no vision for a pass (even if he did no-one else could keep up with him to receive it anyway.) Unfortunately, I agree with the article's main points even though it is biased and carries hidden messages ;-)

Whitey, just for reference we aren't in the black, we've posted £7 mil loss in recent Companies House update. Ashburton, Monny said he heard Wenger directly - although my point still stands about Monny biting lol

PMSL Villan, I'm waiting for Vital to allow subliminal messages, would make my evil Monny agenda far easier!

Agree with Mike Field. MON may or may not see the same problems as some of the fans (and the commentators on Five Live last night) but he must be judged by what he does. He still plays Gabby and Heskey as 'strikers' and they continue to not know what to do with the ball when they get it (even if they get in the right place to do something with it). He continues to play Ash (who sounded brilliant according to Radio commentators) wide to deliver crosses - who apparently last night delivered the ball to 'strikers' who didn't know what to do with it when it arrived. He plays a centre back at right back when he has a perfectly good right back who he plays at left back because he has loaned our reserve left back out. These are facts. It's what he does. When will he accept some responsibility for our results? If he stops being stubborn (maybe he tries to hard to emulate Clough) he will make a great manager. But right now he's looking limited. I am beginning to woner if he has taken us as far as he can.

144wittonlane our loaned out left back was on the bench last night which is yet another strange half backed indecisive thing mon has done . Either leave him at Forest or play him Simple ! Fieldy you are spot on mate!

who cares what Wenger thinks? He has very little class about him for someone who has no doubt been a very good manager.

Its pretty simple - we were promised a plan to get us into the top four. After 3 and 1/2 seasons that isn't going to happen under MON. He has had the monetary back-up to put together his OWN team and we aren't producing results that are better than when he started. Our football is becoming predictable and honestly boring to watch. There are so many obvious issues that for whatever reason aren't being dealt with (Cuellar, l.Young out of position, no rotation, no goal scoring midfielders, no creative midfielders, no goal scoring strikers, Heskey SUCKS). Teams have worked out that we are dangerous at set pieces and counter-attacking but couldn't create a goal scoring opportunity in open play if our opposition were down to 3 men! Its why we get nullified against everyone in the bottom 4 - they play 10 men behind the ball and load the defense for set pieces. They know that they can give us the majority of the possession as it makes us LESS dangerous. What bemuses me is that many of the fans are happy !?!? Are you really satisfied with 6/7th and a decent cup run? Is that the ambitions of the club? Thats the feeling I'm getting - defend MON cause he spent alot of money and can get us a european cup spot which he actually doesn't give a **** about.

To be fair, Weneger's only saying what everyone already knows. The puzzling thing is with Villa's attacking players they don't need to play that way

I think MON should defend his team and give the players all the confidence he can. It would be a poor manager who says "yeah, we couldn't compete cos my players are rubbish". I also think he is right to defend the style of play he thinks works best for Villa. We're doing better than expected so anyone outside the club can sod off and concentrate on their own team.

I like Vital Villa as a site so don't get me wrong. The issue I have, and a lot of avid readers, is that certain site journalists on Vital Villa write articles which for the most part are well written and from a fan's point of view, BUT are often sarcastic and quite sardonic when they could be far more objective and circumspect. I think that's what gets peoples' collective goats and detracts from the issue at hand (i.e. - MON's overreaction to Wenger's fair enough comments). Just my tuppence's worth... no need for the long defensive posts!

Point taken, but you don't come to a fan site for objective news. If it was simple 'reporting' it'd be no different from a mainstream media site, and personally whether I agree or disagree with articles on here (and other fan sites) I think that's the point. The subjective element, what gets your goat etc is the pull. And the fun starts when you disagree. Tis the same when attempting humour in them, some people view it as childish sarcasm, others get a giggle from it. There's no way of meeting all camps down the middle, and stopping doing it completely would ruin the informal nature of sites like this.

Does this count as long and defensive? lol For me, love it loathe it, think I'm a Robbie Savage, argue back in comments, or pen your own rubbishing what I've done. It's the reactions, perceptions, debates I enjoy on here and always have done. Within the realms of decency that also goes for calling me all the names under the sun, it keeps life interesting. lol

I agree with most of what you write, Mike. We do hump the ball up the pitch to the big man, whoever it is. MON did overreact and the media, for the most part, are talking out of the Arsenals when they talk about fast, fluent, counter-attacking football. However, this post has got 40 odd comments not primarily because they disagree with your point, it's that they feel they need to put forward the so called 'MON is the Messiah' side of the argument due to the digs (which weren't exactly needed due to 90 percent of what you wrote being true.) These are just a few observations of an ex-journo and writer and I hope they are taken in the spirit that I've written them in. UTV

My main two points really (although forgive me if I rewrote this it would be different - it was late) were Wenger was pretty much spot on in general, even if not specifically for last night but more importantly the headline spinning by making the comments in response, that would avert for a bit longer questions about strikers etc. The general spin and gloss we've got over the last few years that papers over the real issues that should be addressed.

I did sort of expect it to get into the 'two camp' argument again but just wondered whether the average had turned owing to the Cup run but we seem still very much split as a fanbase which I find interesting.

Maybe the digs weren't needed, but to me they weren't specific digs it's just my humour, and I know some get it and would have a little giggle, others would see it as cynical petulant typical anti Mon ramblings from little old me. Something for everyone I suppose lol

The NCTJ was over a decade ago now, I'd still be doing it if I wanted to make sense Rawlie PMSL I take very little to heart so don't worry about the spirit I've took your comments in :-)

Storm in a tea cup

I remember my NCTJ! That was a while back now too!

"Anybody who saw the game wouldn't take that viewpoint. Ashley Young didn't have time to play long balls when he was taking that left-back [Gaël Clichy] to the cleaners. It's an ­appalling insult." - class act.

Astriel - you are I think delusional!

The only real memories of my NCTJ now are of PUB (lic affairs) singing Monty Python songs. lol

"Wenger was pretty much spot on in general, even if not specifically for last night but more importantly the headline spinning by making the comments in response, that would avert for a bit longer questions about strikers etc. The general spin and gloss we've got over the last few years that papers over the real issues that should be addressed." 100% correct IMHO

All I have to say, please dont come back with insults or anything, no need as I probably wont read the replies...but...MICHAEL OWEN is what we need. He can finish easy chances (which we seem to miss time and time again) , he can play the team player that MON wants so bad i.e. what Heskey is "supposed" to do, and he can take some nice shots when given a chance (which Heskey nor Agbonlahor can do). Why not put in a cheeky loan bid? I can think of about 20 times this season that if Owen had the ball at his feet opposed to Aggy, Heskey, and much less Carew, he would easily slot the ball home when our strikers shoot for the birds.... WE NEED MICHAEL OWEN NO MATTER HIS AGE